1st debate.. ^.-, where do you stand? Options

[DivA]

who would win in a fight ~ Star Wars or Star Trek?
~this includes any & all elements from both universes.. ;p

[Bryn]

Star Wars universe wins, hands down.

Star Trek has some pretty nifty weaponry, and the technology is more highly advanced than Star Wars, but when push comes to shove, no amount of disrupters, phasers, bat‘leths, photon torpedoes, and what-have-you, can possibly match up to the power of the Force. It’s the one true tactical edge Star Wars will always have over Star Trek.

[Retehi]

Star Trek.

Cause I flipped a coin.

[Crushinator]

Doesn't Star Trek have Q or some shit? Can't he just make yoda like, dead in one thought, no matter how much force power he has?

And isn't Star Wars in the past and Star Trek in the future? So like...all the star wars guys are long dead...dead men can't fight. Unless they are zombies. I don't know how photon torpedoes work against zombies.

[Mute]

You kidding? Star Wars has got Jedi. Star Trek has got... umm... Spok. Star Wars wins first round knockout. No contest. ;-)

[Bryn]

QUOTE (Crushinator @ Jul 12 2003, 07:17 AM)

Doesn't Star Trek have Q or some shit?  Can't he just make yoda like, dead in one thought, no matter how much force power he has?

The downside to this is that the Q are kinda flighty and usually only do things on a whim. Since they didn't seem to care too much if the Borg wiped out all humanity, I doubt they would bother for a Star Wars invasion.

However, I forgot that since EP 1 & 2 came out, the Force is no longer a bad ass mystical power, but only a scientific phenomenon that anyone with a high enough Midichlorian count can utilize. The science of Star Trek would easily be able to isolate the Midichlorian symbiants, and find a way to neutralize them, rendering the Force inaccessible.

I reverse my opinion. Star Trek would win. (But only because George Lucas got twisted and decided to make the Force suck.)

[DivA]

*nods* i would have to agree that Star Trek would own Star Wars - true, the Empire is formidable, but if the Borg decide to assimilate them, then there would be no contest - 1 death star against hundreds of borg-cubes equals an Empire assimilated..

[Layrinn]

Whatever... so what if Lucas is on crack. For those of us who saw the first StarWars movies when we were little kids, the Force will always be that wonderful and mysterious power. Don't lose faith, Bryn.

StarWars would totally kick the snot out of StarTrek. Borg + Jedi with lightsaber = dead borg. And let's look at fleet strength. How many federation ships have you ever seen in one place at one time? A dozen or two, maybe? Put them up against the scores of Rebel Alliance capital ships and their hordes of fighters and I doubt they'd last too long. And I think the Empire could hold their own against the Borg. Sure, they only have one Death Star... but they also have a fleet of Star Destroyers and a throng of TIE fighters.

And this is the final straw: Yoda would own Kirk so hard... Kirk would be left huddling in a corner singing "Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds". ;p

[Dive]

ok ok I have decided to join this discussion. I am a fan of both Star Wars and Star Trek, but I favor SW a bit more. Here are my ideas on how this would play out.

Star Wars wins this hands down. Ih you take into account the books, comics, videogames, The Empire has much more resources than the Federation, Borg, Klingons, Romulans, and all others combined. Someone mentioned the Death Star, there are actually 3 Death Stars, not to mention the Eclipse Class Star Destroyer from Dark Empire, which features a main weapon modeled from the Death Star's superlaser. Star Trek simply could not begin to match the sheer numbers and firepower at Lucas' disposal.

Borg what? The Empire simply destroys their home planet with wave upon wave of Tie Fighter bombardment or simply a light blast from the Death Star. Same goes for any other species homeplanet. The rest is simple mop up.

If the Borg decided to assimliate any Jedi, they would immmediately turn to the Dark Side, being mostly machine, and become pawns of either The Emperor or some other Sith Lord. The Borg are doomed in this battle.

The hero's of Star Trek may figure out a way to neutralize the groan Midichlororians but I am sure that Deanna Troi or Geordi would fuck this up somehow

Q? No not really a factor here, the Q care not for the well being of the galaxy, maybe a slight interest in Jean Luc Picard. I fear Picard would be assassinated long before the end of this battle. How many times has his crew been brainfried by some whack alien race, they stand no chance against the hordes of Dark Jedi.

In the end the Dark Side of the Force wins this and any battle.

[Guest_you think so? ^.-_*]

QUOTE (Dive @ Jul 13 2003, 07:13 AM)

Borg what?  The Empire simply destroys their home planet with wave upon wave of Tie Fighter bombardment or simply a light blast from the Death Star.  Same goes for any other species homeplanet.  The rest is simple mop up.

*grins & cracks knucles* alright, it's time to educate you the same way i educate the trekkers - mwa, ha, ha, ha! you forget, all the Borg need do is to assimilate one Star Destroyer - once they do that, it's over; once the Borg incorporates the Empire's technology into their collective, the Borg would modify & modulate all their cubes, spheres & their beings' technology to match anything the Empire could possibly throw at them.. also, when that moment happens, all the death stars couldn't even hope to reach the outer-perimeter of the Borg hive at the Delta quadrant.. any TIE fighter would be picked off with ease, the Borg would receive no damage through the defence of their force fields..

3 death stars : hundreds of borg cubes = do the math.. ;)

the Borg would easily teleport into all death stars & have a field day on everything in their path; in short ~ the Empire would be punish so hard, they think it be a career..

[DivA]

off topic ~ sorry folks, that was me for the last post; i could have sworn i logged-in, but the post says i was not ~ weird.. =.

[Dive]

Good one DivA, however you must know that..

"The ability to assmiiliate an Imperial Star Destroyer is insignificant next to the power of the force."

A solitary Jedi could wreak havoc against the Borg, now take into account hundreds of Jedi all acting in unison to smite the Collective. Never mind the Lightsabers, they could all just telekinetic kill any Borg in their path.

[DivA]

QUOTE (Dive @ Jul 13 2003, 09:50 AM)

A solitary Jedi could wreak havoc against the Borg, now take into account hundreds of Jedi all acting in unison to smite the Collective.  Never mind the Lightsabers, they could all just telekinetic kill any Borg in their path.

ah, but once the Borg scans & compiles all data regarding the Empire ~ the Borg will learn the existence of jedi, sith & their "mysterious" force & that will become the next target to further enhance the Borg collective mind.. out of curiosity, the Borg would want to acquire, understand & incorporate this ability into their vast arsenal of goodies.. the 2 likely targets will be both sith lord & apprentice - now, of course the sith could do damage through the force, but neither are strong enough to challenge the might of the entire collective - this will become a numbers game that sith shall ultimately fall to.. the Borg is open for business 24/7 ~ the sith have to rest sometime.. =}

oh yes, both siths will fall & become incorporated into Borg; then the jedi would be in a world of hurt, for the Borg will give the jedi council the guided tour ~ Borg soldiers armed with the force, that would be something.. O.o last point - light-saber technology would become useless once assimilation is successful, again the Borg's force-field defences would be modulated to block any jedis' strikes.. ^.-

[Mute]

Bleh, the Force is not something that I believe can be "assimilated." I like the whole Borg assimilation thing and all but I'm by no way gonna yield to them as some ultimate power. Aren't they still some sort of machine when it comes down to it all? That Dark Jedi lightning skill will just short em all out before they can "assimilate defense methods." Not to mention, a sith lord and an apprentice are more resourceful than falling to a bunch of Borg. In the end, you got yourself a bunch of mangled bio-machines, and two laughing jedi. ^_^

[DivA]

QUOTE (Mute @ Jul 13 2003, 03:13 PM)

Bleh, the Force is not something that I believe can be "assimilated." I like the whole Borg assimilation thing and all but I'm by no way gonna yield to them as some ultimate power. Aren't they still some sort of machine when it comes down to it all? That Dark Jedi lightning skill will just short em all out before they can "assimilate defense methods." Not to mention, a sith lord and an apprentice are more resourceful than falling to a bunch of Borg. In the end, you got yourself a bunch of mangled bio-machines, and two laughing jedi. ^_^

interesting, now that's interesting ~ if that be the case, & if we look at the force as mystical, then explain how Darth Vader could wield it - especially when he is mostly all machine.. =. the Borg are also a fusion of mechanical & organic material ~ if Darth Vader could wield the force, then so could the Borg - once the collective figures out how.. ^.- also, as the 'ol saying goes - the sith can run, but they cannot hide for long.. =)

the force is not completely mystical ~ like many things before it - science can figure out a way to explain, & ultimately - replicate it..

[Knightsword]

Say could the Emperor not use the mass energy drain againest the borg like he did to the planet Biss, in Dark Empire. Also I beleive it was Exar Kun, The Tales of the Jedi, who used the force to pull solar flares from a sun and use them to destroy an entire planet. Also the force was used to drop a moon on a planet in this series as well.

[Dive]

QUOTE

~this includes any & all elements from both universes.. ;p

This is the case in this discussion and Exar Kun is allowed. The power he holds is more than enough to completely wipe out any "resistance" the Borg may put up.

[Mute]

QUOTE (DivA @ Jul 13 2003, 04:46 PM)

interesting, now that's interesting ~ if that be the case, & if we look at the force as mystical, then explain how Darth Vader could wield it - especially when he is mostly all machine..

Good point, DivA! Well, as we'll hopefully see more clarification about this in the next film, Darth Vader is still a human soul. Indeed, in the earlier films, he's almost completely machine, but I just don't place Vader and Borg in the same category. Being the stingy bastid that I am, I'm not gonna allow myself to believe that Borg can assimilate the Force. ;-)

QUOTE (DivA @ Jul 13 2003, 04:46 PM)

the force is not completely mystical ~ like many things before it - science can figure out a way to explain, & ultimately - replicate it..

Gah! For some reason, I see some sort of secular vs. science debate arising. ^_^; But like I said before, the Borg would be completely annihilated before they could even think about assimilation. >.>;;

[Dive]

"He's more machine now, than man." Darth Vader, being comprised of machine parts is more susceptible to the Dark Side. Thye same would hold true for any Borg who attempted to assimilate the Force. Once they are consumed by the Dark Side, they would be under control of it and at it's bidding.

[Knightsword]

About the Borg I'm pretty sure they've assimilated Vulcans, Right? So where are all the telepathic powers they have? No where thats where so I doubt the Borg would be able to reproduce the effects of the force.

[Crushinator]

Ok, this just got way too geeky. I retract my previous comments.

[Retehi]

This is why I flip coins to make my decisions. >_>

[DivA]

QUOTE (Dive @ Jul 13 2003, 05:24 PM)

"He's more machine now, than man." Darth Vader, being comprised of machine parts is more susceptible to the Dark Side.  Thye same would hold true for any Borg who attempted to assimilate the Force.  Once they are consumed by the Dark Side, they would be under control of it and at it's bidding.

well, given the Borg's track record ~ me thinks that little would change in that regard; both Borg & the darkside of the force would make for a perfect match.. ^.- also, there is an edge in Star Trek's favor - transporters...be it Federation, Borg, Romulan, etc ~ all they need do is lock-on to all the jedi on the surface & transport them to deep space - i highly doubt the force would allow them to breathe, let alone survive the cold ~ the jedi wouldn't know what hit them..

touche'

[DarkEpyon]

Though I'm not too crazy about either one, my money's on the Star Wars gang for reasons already mentioned here. Going OT here, I would be interested to see how they would do against Wing Zero's twin buster rifle or Gundam Double X's twin satellite cannons.

[Khaotika]

3. Khao dun care.

(not a fan of either)

Though I guess if you want me to pick sides, Star Trek. I had this weird thought of Data's cat Spot meowing and the Death Star exploding. Yeah. Someone should make a Flash out of that. :d

*runs off cackling*

-Khao