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Dive
So you want to do something? How about we design a game, and maybe mock up some screens and possibly even get something working. I have been looking at diy game creation programs recently and thought it may be an interesting diversion, something that a lot of people could pool some ideas on. Sound interesting? Our game can be completely fictional, allowing us to go crazy or we can ground it in reality and actually get a working engine running.

A list of affordable creation software, which could be feasable if this takes off. Some of the programs even allow an online game to be designed. It could be as graphically simple as old school Zelda or as complex as a ps1 title.

Ideas, suggestions?

1. The game must have custom character creation.
HC82
Well if were using a rigid game designing tool, then we need a genre, don't we?

Action rpg, or is that too complex? I find shootemup games to allow for some quality action and simple design, but if people want to do more, then that's cool too.
Riel
Maybe we should start small,like HC mentionned...a simple shooter or a puzzle type game maybe? or a point and click type game,something story driven that we could apply to a simple RPG later on...do we want it dark,something like Max Payne for example or something more cheerful,with some comedy?....lots of things we can brainstorm if interested...
Dive
So do you guys think we should actually get something working rather than a theoretical game? I'm all for that. We should make it AT themed in some way.

As for the mood, why not make it dark and with comedy? beigebigeek.gif
AC9breaker
I think this would be an awesome idea. I'm hoping to have a new computer by the end of this month so I'll be doing some research on some of those programs in the following days. A dark comedy thats AT themed sounds like the perfect match to me. Like Bender says, "Comedy is dead. Now tragedy, thats funny!" But yeah we should also start laying down some ground work too on what we would expect to see. Character customization I think is a good one. I would like to see some sort of cameo from AT members in the game or better yet they could be part of the story! haha
Wiryu
You know a shooter done the right way can prove for some great fun, but why not mix it up a bit? Very seldom do people ever try a Shooter-RPG. In a multi-player mode the more kills you get with specific guns and such offer you more exp, and also depending on the level of the other player. I believe we could make a shooter work excellently with an AT theme had we wanted to make a single player mode as well.

A new recruit into the AT army, You have just been AT certified, but prove your worth to the tribe, many tribes along the outside have grown considerably. Work your way through the ranks. Become a Paragorn, of (if attainable throught regular means) an Arbiter Caste and lead members of the tribe into battle against other tribes. Weird thought, but who knows. It's AT themed, it's a shooter, which i am told is what AT was formed from, and add a roleplaying mode to it, you got yourself a game no one dares to try.
Dive
We could also do it arcade style, something like Smash TV. beigelaugh.gif

Here's a quick mock up I did for how this might look.

user posted image
Wiryu
i love it! beigelaugh.gif
Vitamin D
QUOTE (Dive @ Jul 2 2005, 08:35 AM)
We could also do it arcade style, something like Smash TV. beigelaugh.gif

Here's a quick mock up I did for how this might look.

user posted image

Hahahaha that's funny stuff. beigelaugh.gif Well I like the idea, not sure how much design I could do, but I can certainly pitch ideas haha.
Retehi
lmao @ Dive's mock-up.

I got lotsa ideas, I'll get em all down when I get home.

This'll be damn fun!
DarkEpyon
What kind of game design program would we use?
HC82
I think the mock-up says it all.

Besides, who says action games can't have an amazing story and characters to boot?
Wiryu
YES! I am an amazing character and part of an amazing story >:D
tanshin
We have to make a game with ninjas in it. ninja2.gif

That mock up is awesome, lol.
Henge
if we're gonna work on something, itd be cool if we could play it togeather, I.E. online

maybe some kind of simple, sprite-based RPG, we could even give people custom sprites.

such things come to mind as ragnarok online, but more with futuristic setting, like fallout II ect. heh a cyberpunk theme would be boss. a nice departure from ghosts and goblins.

just some thoughts heh

tanshin
I liked Woe's idea. We could start very, very simple by simply making one small zone made of grass for multiple people to walk around in. Then just build from there. Not only that, sprites are awesome.
Retehi
We should try something with the CS2D engine if you want simple.

http://www.cs2d.com/

Just download it, and try (gameplay sucks, but the engine could lead to some better ideas from people around here).

Tho I'm biased towards something with some firepower. =\

Hell if you want the RPG thing, look at Shaq Fu RPG: http://www.shaqfu.org/rpg.html

Over the top, but imagine what we could do. beigelaugh.gif
Henge
QUOTE (Sgt. Retehi @ Jul 3 2005, 06:20 PM)
Tho I'm biased towards something with some firepower. =\

lets clone wolfenstien3D and put zio's head on all the enemies. beigelaugh.gif

and when you shoot them...


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
DarkEpyon
The program that Shaq one was made in is called RPG Tsukuru (Maker) 2000. There's an updated version called RPG Maker 2003. RM2k3 was essentially a revamped 2000 with some added features, including a side-view default battle system. The latest in that series is RPG Maker XP, which of course runs on WinXP. This one gives you nearly infinite customization, HOWEVER you'll have to code it in a language called RGSS (which is similar to VB and others). Some amazing things have been done with this.
Dive
QUOTE (Sgt. Retehi @ Jul 3 2005, 07:20 PM)
We should try something with the CS2D engine if you want simple.

http://www.cs2d.com/

It looks like CS2D was created with Blitz 3D, which actually shows some potential but it costs $80. I'm downloading the 30 day trial right now.

Interface screenshots

Lots of good ideas so far, let's keep them coming.
HC82
I'm actually familiar with rpg maker 2k. I really remember fooling around with it for quite sometime and at least making an incomplete 25 hours rpg. I got bored with finishing the game and decided I had learned what I needed as a learning tool, so finishing the game would be pointless. You could do some pretty cool things with it and I'm sure the latest version would allow for some quality product. I have no ideas about the other versions.

It essentially taught me how utterly time consuming it is to make something that looks so simple. A well designed engine is key, but somethings just take a lot of time. Those little cut scences you see probably take longer to plan then the dungeons you run around in. That is assuming they aren't shitty cut scences, all of them are drawn out in detail and broken down like a comic book, breaking things down scence by scence; it's the sameway they do it in the movies.

I'm not saying we should do that, but it just underscores the importance of organization.
Kazicht
QUOTE (HC82 @ Jul 4 2005, 04:41 AM)
...all of them are drawn out in detail and broken down like a comic book, breaking things down scence by scence; it's the sameway they do it in the movies.

Aye. Actually the creative process for story heavy 3D games these days is alot like the process it takes to plan a film. Which is usually why intro to film and traditional Disney style animation courses is part of most curriculum for CG animation and game design.
Dive
Alright lets get rolling on this. I think the best place to start is to to decide on a genre. Action RPG, Arcade, Shooter, or something else. Kart racer? beigelaugh.gif Lots of ideas have been put forth, now let's come together on one. I am cool with whatever the majority decides but for sake of starting the decision process, I am going to give one vote to Action RPG with the following:

1. Custom Characters
2. AT Theme
3. Sci-Fi setting
Henge
i think action rpg would be a good middle ground genre, i 2nd that vote.
Riel
I've read good things about this book called "The Art of Producing Games"...if you can find it in a library somewhere it might help...i will try and track it down around here and maybe even buy it.

user posted image

http://www.courseptr.com/ptr_detail.cfm?gr...59200%2D611%2D6
Crushinator
While a homebrow RPGmaker game can be amusing, I think in the end it is too much work for what results in basically a fan-fic with some cheesy battles. Even with an AT theme I just don't think the stale JRpg gameplay would make for a compelling game.

Action is definetly the way to go; multiplayer 2d balls-out shooting is totally the AT style. I think a game that is pick-up-and-play, intense, and cooperative would be the most appealing, and you don't need to worry too much about story development when the gameplay is the core.

That 2d CS engine looks like it has some potential, and I remember reading about a version of the Tribes: Vengeance engine has been tailored for 2d gameplay as well, but still retains all the physics, netplay, and scripting Tribes allows.

The mockup Dive posted is actually a damn fine start, as far as concept goes. I'm thinking maybe a gauntlet-style thing with large areas for each stage (not just single screens like Smash TV) but of course in a cool futuristic or post-apoc setting.

Some other random ideas:
-Food for health! I'm glad you put a burger there, Dive. I'm sick of games where you use a medpack to get HP. Bring back Ham Hocks, Turkeys, Soda, and Little fuck-hens. buttrock.gif

-If we can't pull off character customizaton, make the selectable players (or NPCs) AT personalities, and then have said people record voice samples for in-game hilarity.

-Probably goes without saying, but big-ass bosses, where you would need the cooperation of the people playing to outwit them or something. Not just 4 guys pumping lead into it and strafing around till it dies. Also, one of the bosses has to be a giant squid. They are awesome.

-Maybe keep away from character growth/RPG stuff. But each selectable player character/class should of course have different strengths and weaknesses, and you can augment that with powerups you get on the playfield. Seems like it would be easier to maintain the balance and difficulty of the game this way.
donkeybeatz
WTF its crushinator?!
HC82
Yeah, I know. He just pops out of nowhere.

I like the idea of something action based. It's really more the AT way, considering FPS/PSO is its roots.

I really think the first things to conside are:

The gameplay mechanics and what gamed design engines can be used to achieve that. Honestly, the gameplay might have to reflect the limitations of any avaliable game design engine. So what type of gameplay will probably spawn from the game engines avaliable.

Storyboard, atmosphere, and characters:

Serious, funny, dark, or many elements???
The environments, enemies, bosses, characters, weapons, power-ups, etc are all going to be derived from the story and atmosphere.

The name "Apocalypse Tribe" is darker in nature and I seriously think the game should somehow have a storyline that deals with "Apocalypse Tribe." Not per se, as an online gaming crew, but somehing fictional that weaves AT into something intriguing and most likely sci-fi. Something that takes the name "Apocalypse Tribe" and sculpts it into a kickass story that make sense when you see "Apocalypse Tribe."

If people plan to get serious into this, once a game engine is found, I think developement should be done like it's usually done with any game. Different "cells" work on different parts of the game and freely exchange with oneanother. It's a horizontal chain of command, but each section is a primary focus on a certain area.

There is no point in working on a story yet, that is intill "the meat and potatoes" of the game (game engine and people who want to work on the gameplay) is good to go.

Since this is an attempt at making an AT product, it really shouldn't skimp in the quality of imagination and creativity. Anyone can throw some stupid shit together with a basic game design engine and call it a video game.

I think we want the game to reflect AT in a way where it's something developed that can surpass the quality of some gamer-kid whose idea of a game is rehash of everything he's played.

BTW the AT characters in the game idea is great! Different AT personalities appear in the story and some are playable.
Dive
I just wanted to update this and mention that I have been trying out a few game design programs. Some of them require moderate knowledge of coding and compiling, which I am a novice at, and a couple are almost as simple as drag and drop. I'll try and get a working basic "room" completed soon. Probably something like I mocked up earlier and what Crush said about a Gauntlet style game.

Anyone up to the task of messing with the heavier code based programs?

Soon as we find a suitable program, we can start the design process and split up into design teams like HC82 said. That's a great way to do this.

I would like as many people as possible who want to work on this to be a part of the production crew. This isn't something we are going to hammer out in a couple weeks, so think about what you would like to do, we got plenty of time.
Dive
I got a working sample room completed. This is by no means a game, just an example of what can be done. I used a Guy sprite from Final Fight and made a cheap on the fly animation with a few frames and found some random background image somewhere. You are able to move Guy around and even punch, although there is nothing to attack yet. There is also no collision on the room borders so you can walk right off the screen.

Let me know if you are able to load and play this demo.

AT Assault Demo 5MB

Movement with the arrow keys and punch with ctrl.

and no, you cannot pick up the hamburger yet.

beigelaugh.gif
DarkEpyon
Too bad the sprite disappears when you press the spacebar.
Vitamin D
Hahaha, go Guy! Definitely a good starting point, I think we could really get creative with this. The only design experience I had was working with a friend on RPG Maker on PSX. A lot was done for you, but DAMN it was a lot of work to get some effects right. We came out with a pretty decent length game (After several hundred hours of work...), and I actually had a lot of fun doing it. I also don't mind at all what type of game it is, I'm just excited at the idea of it all.
Retehi
The lame PC's here won't let me download EXE's. =\

I'll check it out later tonight at the university here, the ghostly hamburger I hear about makes it worth the trip. beigelaugh.gif

Dive
I really think this is the game engine we will use. I spent a couple hours on that demo but that was because I was learning the program at the same time. I could redo that starting point from scratch in under an hour, not counting character design and animation. Everything we need is contained in the interface, and I think we could do just about any kind of 2D game with it. All we need to do to make it ours, is to insert our own custom sprites and background graphics.

How about a side scrolling beat em up/shoot em up game? We can come up with a couple twists to enhance the gameplay but keep it old school. This program can also implement online multiplayer apsects as well. Picture 4 players, with 4 custom sprites to choose from, and the ability to enter your own name with top score rankings.

Cool? buttrock.gif

On the player animation side, I don't think it would be too much of an endeavor if four of us each tackled one sprite apiece. We would need a static standing view, walking, punch/kick, shoot, and jump animations. 4-5 frames or less per action is fine I think, as I can stretch the animation within the program.

QUOTE (DarkEpyon @ Jul 8 2005, 11:16 AM)
Too bad the sprite disappears when you press the spacebar.
dude. This is from scratch and my first attempt, cut me come slack beigelaugh.gif

Actually, Guy is a Ninja right? So Spacebar is his Super Sneaky Ninja Vanish Attack. ninja2.gif
HC82
Ok, it's good to see things underway. Genre doesn't matter to me, just quality of the overall product.

Ninja Vanish!

Wouldn't that be a cool move?

Well, if you really think about, you can begin to see how the imagination really is a key component to quality game design. Both games can be fun, but the coolness factor sometimes adds so much.
DarkEpyon
The "ninja vanish" thing would be cool. Believe it or not, Guy is seen in Namco X Capcom and is supposedly one of the best characters. Also, didn't mean to be hypercritical earlier, so my apologies.
Dive
QUOTE (DarkEpyon @ Jul 8 2005, 08:35 PM)
Also, didn't mean to be hypercritical earlier, so my apologies.

No harm done man. I should have mentioned that the spacebar action was incomplete.

No really, it's Ninja Vanish. beigebiggrin.gif

I am truly excited about this, there really is no limit to what we can accomplish here. I was talking to a couple people about this, and thought it would be cool to offer 8 selectable characters for 4 player action. I was also thinking about how we could spruce up the 2D gameplay and had in mind vertical stages in addition to side scrolling. Not so much vertical platforms, but maybe the players need to traverse down a sheer airshaft or something like that crazy skydiving stage in Powerstone 2. Players may even have to mount jetbikes or something for a vertical shooting stage.

So many ideas, I hope we can fit them all in.
AC9breaker
Since my computer is a giant turd, I can't play the game. All that happens is my computer freezes up.

However good news is that I am expecting my new PC sometime this coming weekend, so hopefully I will get a chance to test out the AT mock up game. Also would like to take a shot at the code heavier programs once I get my PC. I have some knowledge of computer languages such as C++,Pascal, Java, and Basic beigelaugh.gif
So I would enjoy trying to put my knowledge to use.
Riel
Hah,that's a nice little example...a beat em up could be fun...i wonder if we could make little cut scenes in between levels to tell a bit of a story as well...cool stuff.
Icaras
i miss smash tv...
AC9breaker
I just played the AT Assult demo, haha sweet! that music is totally sounds like post apocalyptic music. Great stuff. trophy.gif I can't wait to see how we shape this up.
Wiryu
I've been away for a few days, but you guys have been busy! The game is looking great so far. Very smooth, nice action transactions, and some badass music. Bravo, Bravo! And i love the "ninja vanish" move beigelaugh.gif
proj
Something simple would be best.. I like the online idea.. and +1 for character development. What do you guys thing of just starting with game that can be built up from a chat shell?

Something humorous would be fun like a completly wacky pseudo online rpg where you can join on a server and use wacky effects and what not on other people and generally mock the whole mmorpg genre ;)
Dive
QUOTE (proj @ Jul 14 2005, 01:13 PM)
Something simple would be best.. I like the online idea.. and +1 for character development. What do you guys thing of just starting with game that can be built up from a chat shell?

Something humorous would be fun like a completly wacky pseudo online rpg where you can join on a server and use wacky effects and what not on other people and generally mock the whole mmorpg genre ;)

Well we have already started work on an action beat em up/shoot em up side scroller, but there is no reason why we have to make only one game. I am very interested in what you can bring to this endeavor proj, I'll hit you up on a chat if I can reach you.

Here is where we are continuing the action game discussion brainstorm.
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