What makes a good FO? Options

[DarkEpyon]

I saw this mentioned on another board, and wondered how some of you felt. For me, staying on top of the needs of shifta/deband/resta is a good thing. Knowing what element to use on what enemy for optimal damage is also good. Basically someone who is attentive to the needs of his/her teammates.

[Knightsword]

I agree with those points and here is another one.
A good force is one who tries not to be something they arn't, a melee fighter. When a force tries to go head on with weapons, he or she can be a major liability to the team.

[Sheik]

True especially for FOnls. I never have tried melee with my FOnl except for fun...heh. 100 damage here and there in ult...lol. But, I have started using tech attacks more. I attack with techs and support at the same time which is diffucult at times to do. I just have to have my quick meny arranged correctly. That helps to have S/D/Anti on top and Ry/Re/J/Z on the bottom. I can go though an entire 10 trifluids in a seabed run now...which tells me that I am helping more than just with support which I like.

[HC82]

Being at the top of your game when it comes to support, if you do that much then your a good FO; although It is kinda hard to resta asap when your getting smacked around.

S/D/J/Z/R ASAP, that is the way of the FO. Anything after that is just extra.

[AC9breaker]

Hmm what makes a good FO? ummm HC82 does. Dive does. Bryn does. Hey why not put them all in a pot an dmix them up ! what would we get!? A super Sayien Hyperr Drive 1337 FO to the 4th power fo.lol Hey with all this multie weapon thing going on, who knows. It would be like dangiao or even better Voltron! "and I'll form the head".

[Bryn]

QUOTE (Knightsword @ Aug 10 2003, 07:56 PM)

I agree with those points  and here is another one. A good force is one who tries not to be something they arn't, a melee fighter. When a force tries to go head on with weapons, he or she can be a major liability to the team.

In challenge definately, but in regular play I have to disagree. There have been many successful FOmar/marl tankers which can hold their own in melee as well cast the usual support techs, without being a liability. Granted a FO is not going to deal the same amount of damage as a hunter, but I think basically comes down to a matter of style and the personality of the character.

[Alisha]

QUOTE (Bryn @ Aug 11 2003, 01:22 PM)

QUOTE (Knightsword @ Aug 10 2003, 07:56 PM) I agree with those points  and here is another one. A good force is one who tries not to be something they arn't, a melee fighter. When a force tries to go head on with weapons, he or she can be a major liability to the team. In challenge definately, but in regular play I have to disagree. There have been many successful FOmar/marl tankers which can hold their own in melee as well cast the usual support techs, without being a liability. Granted a FO is not going to deal the same amount of damage as a hunter, but I think basically comes down to a matter of style and the personality of the character.

i second what bryn said they have that atp for a reason

[DivA]

there are 2 types of force avatars ~ those that heal & offer support, & those that battle & offer support...both paths work well.. =} my first character during ver.1 was FOmarl ~ my persona during the beginnings was geared towards healing & support for adventuring team members; however, upon reaching high levels ~ i have been known to obliterate whole rooms filled with baddies with TP to spare.. ^.-

& then, i discovered the HUnewearl; but that's, another story.. ;p

[Angel of Enders]

I could care less about Shifta or Zalure. As long as a Force can keep a monster from flooring me with their damn critica hits then I you'll have my support in addition to your own.

[Rogue]

Resta and support techniques take priority. Yes, I tank, and no I'm not a liability (except in Seabed but at level 130 why the hell would I even think about tanking there in the first place?)

On tanking... I agree with Lish- the ATP is there for a reason. Of course, human FO ATA blows, so hit percents also make a world of difference.

[unitself]

hehhee.
All of these reasons here are why you will never want me on your team as a force. I can't remember which spell does what, and I can never remember to heal others. I don't even shifta and deband myself when I am offline. :D
I blame the robots.
Still, I have a FO and I think he's keen. So, if you see him online and just want another body on your low level team, grab me. I could use the practice!
Here's a question. When you guys talk about a melee vs. support, you not talking about a force that JUST heals and shiftas and debands and stuff, right? A force has got to level somehow! And those fireballs aren't used for healing! I can't see there being much fun in simply standing out of the way and watching everyone's HP. Or, maybe I am just taking all of this a little too literally?

[DivA]

if one follows the path of the healer FO, there are other ways of leveling; in some ways, it's faster than simple melee attacking.. =. in addition to healing others & ensuring that all in the party are protected with defence techs, i utilize jellen ~ this tags the baddies so when they fall to the HU or RA, i acquire exp points...this is implemented to balance the leveling process for all avatars in PsO.. ^.-

[Azrael]

QUOTE (Knightsword @ Aug 10 2003, 07:56 PM)

I agree with those points and here is another one. A good force is one who tries not to be something they arn't, a melee fighter. When a force tries to go head on with weapons, he or she can be a major liability to the team.

I agree. Sometimes I think it's so annoying when I see a low lvl FOmar using a S-Rank Twin(unless it has TP Steal) or one that's doing more damage than any hunter on the team. I think it's ok when you're alone but when you're on a team, do your job. lol

[HC82]

I think one thing people are over looking is that the support aspect of a FO is the mandatory duty of a Force, just like a robot using traps at the right situation, but then it breaks down into melee or tech casting. That's the other part of the FO, because just casting resta and J/Z isn't exactly gameplay.

Personally I never liked the fact that you either had to be one or the other. If you melee, it's usually because your tech damage is too low to be effective for most situations, likewise if you just nuke, it's because your tech damage is far more effective then your melee. There are a few situations where one type proves more usefull then other type, yet I don't think Forces should be limited to just situational events where you either have to do one or the other. I think a Force should melee and tech cast accordingly.

I am thinking back to the orginal Phantasy Stars, where even a HUmar type character(the main characters) could whoop out some crazy tech damage, but TP actually being limited restricts the player from using it often and only using it during tight situations. We all know that Hunter tech damage totally blows. Its only use is to tag enemies and deal a bit of damage in the process, while rabarta is the only support based attack tech. Likewise even the Forces are some what limited to what they can and can't do when it comes to tech casting or melee, simply because one just isn't as effective as the other. Enemies like C bringer and ep2 sinows either resist tech damage or null all tech amps, including racial amps. Come on, thats like when you fight a Sinow, any percents on your weapon don't take effect(including hit %). BOTH should be effective, even for a Hunter class. Come on Hunters, when is the last time you actually used gibarta or gifoie, and it was actually to your advantage?

Talk is cheap, I know, so iam not suggesting like most people who say "Tech damage sucks, it should deal the most damage like a wizard does in other RPGs". They don't realize that if this was true Hunters and Rangers would be useless and that if you gave forces that kinda non stop nuking power, you'd have to take away their support aspect, but it's both aspects that make a Force appealing to play, not just one. Also this is PSO, part of it's charm is that it is different from other rpgs. Regardless of that, most people would probably agree that making both melee and damage techs effective for a FO/HU would be both cool and enhance the gameplay for each class, yet maintaining a balance so that each class is usefull and not overpowerful might seem hard. I think the questions is HOW? Hey, I wouldn't have made this rant if I couldn't think how it could be done succesfully myself(because it can), but last time I checked I am not an employee for ST.

[OzzaJW]

I think a good force is a force that does thigns right.... The priority for them as a support character is to SUPPORT their partners. This means the first things they should do are d/s and j/z (notice d/s not s/d, i always cast deband first as whats the point in shifta if your partners are all dead..... lol), but after that, unless in challenge when you have TP and MST restricted you should attack. Make sure your attacks are timed well so they cancel enemy attacks. this is a little spoken about thing, but i find the best FO's will time their attacks rather than hammer at the techs. I couldn't care less about deband and jellen if the FO knows my attack pattern in comparison to the enemies, and can pick their attacks at the time when i'm vulnerable and the enemy is attacking, I went thru Ult Ruins the other day without needing to heal once until Ruins 3 because the FO just didn't let me get touched.

As for melee, yes they can cope for themselves which is fine for variance, but ultimately they are not a hunter. If they can cope on their own 9in attack, they're primary role is still as a support character who should defend themself and their partners. On my FOmar for one i don't use my weapons for attack, but to help with my support (geist Vulcans 35% hit.... i use it to restore TP all the time).

A force in relationship to a ranger should never draw the enemies attention to them and vice versa. If a force and ranger get in a pickle with enemies it is the forces job to direct the attention towards the hunter and then support him, as the RA would be useless in close range alone, whereas a FO with a Hunter is priceless.